Thinking of summer and the closing of Main Street
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12 hrs is too much
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The point seemed to be to deny another group the chance to have a gathering albeit a political gathering. That is silly. It would be great to have an event that is family friendly and includes everyone, but closing Main St for 12 hrs on a holiday doesn't serve that idea. Kudos to the city for their decision. |
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Growing up
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For once the City Commissioners made a good decision. Personally, when I look FW to spring/summer I think of a garden and the fresh produce it will yield. That's "family oriented." |
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The REAL Agenda
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| The real agenda was to promote Leland's group - GCGLJ - and shut out any plans the Bozeman Tea Party had for a march down Main Street (which, by the way, I haven't heard anything about yet). I don't think any one group ought to be allowed a monopoly of Main Street on this day - whether it be for a "community" or "political" event - make it first come first serve, limit the number of hours each group gets, limit the overall number of hours Main Street will be closed, and this in turn will limit the number of groups that can participate that day. It would be a violation of our first amendment rights to disallow any public marches/protests/events that day, and that is not the answer. The most fair answer, in my opinion, is just what I wrote above. | |
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July 4th Stroll
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The idea of shutting down Main Street on the 4th isn't really a bad idea. If it were to help the community celebrate the holiday, maybe as a summer version of the Christmas Stroll. Maybe it would get people away from doing annoying fireworks. As far as marches go. What good did either march do last year? Other than that the Gay Loggers' march paid for the street closure and put some money into the coffers at the Food Bank. For which they can be proud. |
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Poo
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| The only "loggers" I saw were a few "dog logs" left on the sidewalk. The Tea Party, by comparison, garnered a large following and we listened to several inspiring speeches on the courthouse steps, while celebrating what the day really means - the freedom to do just what we were doing, as well as other freedoms! What good did it do? It rallied people. It showed everyone we are not an "astro turf" movement. They have tried to get rid of us by calling us names, making out like we're idiots and extremists. Yet the Tea Party continues to grow - and will continue to grow with people of all stripes - Democrats, Republicans, Libertarians, and people just plain fed up with government spending and over-expansion into our lives. Watch for our parade April 15th! | |
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P.S.
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| I'll bet all the Tea Party people have contributed to the food bank, including myself, as well as other charities. Think about that. Leland has done nothing any more "special" as far as charity goes than anyone else. In fact, he has done LESS in my opinion, because of his uncharitable views regarding our freedoms and our over-reaching government. | |
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Food Bank
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I'm sure individually, those who did the Tea Party rally last year, do contribute to the food bank, as do those who participated in the Gay Loggers march. But Brian Leland used the event as an opportunity to raise funds from the event to help the food bank. Did the Tea Party rally do that? Don't know for sure, but if they weren't even willing to foot the expense of closing main street, well the Tea Party membership seems a little "tight" with their money. So, Alpha Beagle. What names have the Tea Party people been called? Republicans? Conservatives? |
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RE: Food Bank
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| Leland's "contribution to charity" was insincere, in my opinion, and done with an ulterior motive to make the Tea Party group look like scrooges. The people I know in the Tea Party are far from that. Besides, WHERE WAS LELAND WHEN OTHER GROUPS MARCHED? Did he come out and counter them? Did he contribute to "charity" to show them up? Perhaps we should require ALL groups who want to march down Main Street to have to donate to the Food Bank! Heck, why stop there? Let's require them to contribute to other charities. And who will decide? Sorry - but the Tea Party was not marching in the name of contributing to charities. If Leland's group's agenda was to do so - fine (but I don't believe it). Also, the government is already doing a fine job of trying to force us into "redistribution of wealth". I'd rather contribute to charities I want to contribute to - not be forced by humiliation (good try, Leland) or my government to do so! And that is also part of the reason the Tea Party marched - and will continue to be on the march! | ||
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Typical A/B
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We think we speak the truth so we are the only voice that matters. Edited to add: Again A/B you just crack me up. When in a hole, stop digging. |
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RE: Typical A/B
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| Right of Left - You couldn't have described yourself better. | ||
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Agreement??
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AB: I'll agree with you to an extent. I would have been better if Brian had done an event where all money raised went to the food bank. As it was, they only got the surplus. But having said that, it was a nice sum. He could have made his business a "non-profit" and paid himself a salary. OK, so when the Tea Party next has a march, put out a jar for the food bank, and make it voluntary. How about it? |
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RE: Agreement??
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| I'm going to put out a donation jar so people can contribute to stop abortion. To me, that's a worthy cause. Perhaps we should all be forced to contribute to certain charities - now wouldn't that be charitable? Think about it. | ||
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Kudos to commission
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| I'm in agreement- shutting down Main Street for the entire day is ridiculous. I personally avoid downtown like the plague when any type of "demonstration" is planned. At least if demonstrations are limited to a few hours, I can skip the "festivities" and still support downtown. | |
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Re: Agreement
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AB: So as instructed I thought about it. Is the money jar you are putting out to stop abortion going to be given to a woman who is trying to decide if she can support her unborn, or is it going to be used for Super Bowl ads or to help pay for acting lessons for Tim Tebow and his mom? As far as the Gay Loggers go, there are probably a higher percentage of pro choice members in the Loggers as there is in the Tea Party people. But I don't think the money raised for the Food Bank by the Gay Loggers is designated to be given to pro choice people only. You questioned earlier Leland's sincerity and motives for giving to the Food Bank. I can't say with certainty there is no agenda, but I can speak to the results in terms of the gain to the Food Bank. |
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RE: Re: Agreement
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| And I can say with certainty that granting life to all does not discriminate on the basis of race, wealth or any other factors. I don't think the money raised to stop abortion is to stop the abortion of white babies only. Get it? | ||
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WTF?
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How did this discussion morph in an Abortion discussion? Oh yeah, A/B joined in. |
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Re: WTF (wadded tin foil?)
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ROL: Now, now, I'm equally at fault here on taking it that direction, about abortion. But now it seems to be going toward a discussion on race. So someone else will need to pick up the ball on that. I live in Bozeman so I'm not qualified to enter a discussion on race or diversity. Nice weather, were having today, isn't it? Hope it's nice on July 4th. |
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Obviously You Didn't Get It
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| It's obvious neither one of you got the point I was making. This is not a discussion of abortion or race. To make it simpler for you (hoping it's simple enough) the Tea Party March was not to raise funds for charity! If another group wants to march for charity, so be it. The Tea Party marches are about out-of-control government - government that continues to spend into the future, so that our descendents will be nothing more than indentured servants to a tryannical government. We are moving quickly towards a bigger government that wants to take over our lives. That includes what "charities" we must give to, in the form of "entitlement" programs - i.e., "spread the wealth". The wealth will be spread, alright, so that there will no longer be a middle class to which the poor can aspire to become part of. We will ALL be poor, far less free - with a small elite class far, far above us, controlling us. If this is what you want, you are well on the way to getting it - and you will deserve everything you get (or more accurately, don't get). | |
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RE: Obviously You Didn't Get It
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No A/B we do "GET IT" or at least understand what you believe. I won't speak for Art, but I think in many ways you are correct, but as a whole and in the end you are wrong. |
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Not getting it
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To me, out of control government is one that spends our taxes without regards to how the taxpayers want it spent. Which can include them paying the extra burden and expenses related to closing off main street for the Tea Party march. And the Tea Party isn't even a charity. But it's always sounded to me that they feel an entitlement to having taxpayers foot the bill for this expense. A counter to this arguement is that maybe all groups pay for street closure. I'm OK with that. As I recall, small as the numbers were, the loggers did pay their own way. As stated, I wish they would do an event without any expense needed to pay the city so that all funds could go to the food bank, so I'm not putting them on a pedestal either. |
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RE: Not getting it
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| Art - Actually, I agree with part of what you say. Maybe ALL groups should pay for closure of Main Street. Let's put that to a vote! The trouble with what occurred is that suddenly, after years and years and years of Main Street being closed for one group or another, without a peep from anyone, when it came to the Tea Party, suddenly a few started hollering for the Tea Party group to PAY for Main street to be closed! Where were these people when other groups, (including those of a particular political, religious, moral or other type of "bent") wanted to close Main Street for a march or other gathering? Who decides who pays? I guarantee you that no sooner would we start charging for closure, there will be an outcry from groups that want to be exempted from being charged. Then someone will have to decide who's exempt and why - on what will they base their decision? Who decides what is and isn't "fair"? In truth, the only "fair" thing to do, as you say, is to charge ALL groups or charge NONE of them. | ||
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Other considerations
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Bozeman business people are interested in putting it's best foot forward. It's important not to close Main St and make the national news for some frivolous reason that makes locals ashamed or deters visitors and newcomers from coming here. It costs everyone some- thing when a mistake is made. |
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RE: Other considerations
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| As a local, I am in no way ashamed of my beliefs. If other people in town feel "ashamed" for people exercising their free speech rights, then I am ashamed of them. As for putting "our best foot forward" - we do that when we speak up in support of our country, our (legal) citizens, and our constitution. We put our best foot forward when we are proud of what our country is supposed to stand for - FREEDOM! | ||
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Close it permanently
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| I like the idea of closing Main Street from Rouse to 7th and turning it into a walking mall. | |
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RE: Close it permanently
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| Now this is an idea that was proposed by some people years ago. I like it. It makes sense in the fact that we live in a cold climate for much of the year. That's why many shop at the mall - nice and warm and enclosed. Not sure how we'd go about it without huge expense, though. How would it be constructed, etc.? | ||
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Close it permanently
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Are you thinking of the Mall in Boulder, CO and other college towns like Charlottesville VA? Why do we have to become like the places you left. Trends are just fads. The entire thing would have to be enclosed with our winters as in Twin Cities, MN. Sounds expensive and foolish. |
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RE: Close it permanently
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Close Cwrite. Instead, close it, keep it shoveled in the winter and make it an outdoor walking mall. This is Montana! It gets cold here in the winter and we dress for that climate. Think how amazing it would be to stroll the Main Street Walking Mall during the winter. Sure it will be cold, so what? It would make stopping into a local merchants shop for a hot beverage very appealing. Put in some more cheap/free parking and close it say I! |
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Only one way to pay to close it off for good
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| The money needed to close off Main Street permanately would obviously have to be paid from taxes. So, Tea Party folks, is this OK with you? I can't see as how the Gay Loggers could come up with the money for this one. | |
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RE: Only one way to pay to close it off for good
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Don't see how it would be that expensive to close Main Street to vehicles if we did it like the Europeans. Here's a link to Große Eschenheimer Straße in Frankfurt, Germany showing how they use stanchions to block off metropolitan areas for pedestrian access only: (Click on the image for a larger view.)  I chose Frankfurt for 2 reasons: 1. I've actually done a lot of shopping in that part of town in all seasons and it was very pleasant and worked well. 2. Their weather is very similar to ours and — although they block off traffic in certain areas — they haven't put up enclosures or additional structures. They just wear their coats and scarves in the winter and pop into a coffee house, bar, or café if they need to warm up. (More winter business for coffee houses, bars, and cafés. Yay revenue!) Our Main Street would actually be somewhat easier to convert than some others because the alleys are already in place and would allow access for deliveries, customer entrance from parking lots, etc. |
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RE: Only one way to pay to close it off for good
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| Again - this is something everyone in Bozeman would have to vote on. Also, I think it's incredibly funny I get a one-star rating above for agreeing with Montana007, while he/she gets 3 5-star ratings. Tell me, is it just me? Boo-hoo, waaaaah. | ||
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Traffic where?
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How will people get from the East entrance of Bozeman to the West Side if the middle of Main is closed to traffic? How many of you want the traffic on the two oneways plus Main to be diverted past your front doors. Surely the oneways will be returned to twoway traffic. There is a logistics problem here. Only the young and foolish can ride their bicycles year round. |
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RE: Traffic where?
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Good points, cwrite. Obviously this is not something that should be done frivolously. [Edited to add:] RE:“How will people get from the East entrance of Bozeman to the West Side if the middle of Main is closed to traffic?” I assume you're referring to motorists. They could allow a couple of cross streets to remain open as vehicle thoroughfares with the Main Street crosswalks clearly marked and crossing controlled by the traffic lights. The problem of the extra traffic in the alleys and on Mendenhall and West Babcock would be quite a bit more complicated. (Isn't Main Street also a truck route?) The city commissioners would probably have to mandate several very expensive studies. ;) |
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RE: Traffic where?
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| I agree, cwrite. I also laughed at your last comment, "Only the young and foolish can ride their bicycles year round". I almost squashed one of them as their bike slipped on the ice in the street. Luckily, I was not distracted by a cell phone or polishing my nails, and was able to avert running over their head like some Halloween pumpkin! | ||
